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New Kayak (similar to glide pro from Rays @$999

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Re: New Kayak (similar to glide pro from Rays @$999

Postby laneends » 26 Sep 2016, 23:05

FishnDive wrote:
Yako wrote:Welcome Lloyd :wave1:
I'm surprised you took the rudder off??
Have you tried turning the yak in rough conditions (choppy or windy) without the rudder?
If the yak is 4m the turning radius can't be that great???


Believe it or not Rich in a paddle yak the turning circle is better with the rudder out of the water than in it. You shouldn't actually use a rudder to turn a paddle yak, its more to help track straight into the wind. If you are turning a paddle yak, you 'should' use a sweep stroke, with the rudder down the rudder is the pivot point, hence giving a long turning circle, if you pull the rudder up on the other hand the pivot point becomes the centre of the yak so it turns in its own length and is much more efficient.



Learned that the hard way on surf day,. You can spin a yak to face the waves far quicker with rudder up rather than down, by using proper kayak strokes. In reality if you have a rudder deployed you will alter course with it routinely as it is convenient, probably at a cost of not learning correct paddling techniques. Then again fishos often aren't too fussed about proper techniques.

The revo16 is a bitch to turn or course correct by paddle alone, so I need to practice more as you can't use rudder control effectively when paddling.
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Re: New Kayak (similar to glide pro from Rays @$999

Postby Joshua » 27 Sep 2016, 00:03

Legrant wrote:Hi all,

The seat is shite, will fix it.

The rudder is shite, figured I don't need it.

I'm 70 kg and it feels pretty stable, yet to properly test it out though.

Anyone had any experience with these or a glide pro?



Hey mate, I own one of these and fished out of it all last season with Nathan from this forum. (we have the model before this, the only real difference is the center hatch)

70kg will be fine in this yak, I'm 80. Nathan is... more than 80.. and he is still fishing out of it to this day.

I actually like the seat, hugs the body nicely, however i did chuck a piece of yoga matt underneath to soften it on longer days on the water.

We never once used the rudder, like others have said it is bad for paddle technique and you shouldn't ever need it unless you are trying track straight through choppy weather.

They handle well and are very stable for the price (on total flat days i can stand up in this yak however a wave or a wrong lean and you're in the drink so i don't recommend you try it unless you're prepared to flip the yak, I did it to test re entry)

all in all its a decent yak for the price. Get's you to the fish and will be able to go pretty much anywhere some of the more expensive kayaks can go.
you are a bigger limitation than the kayak. Know how far you can paddle and what conditions you can paddle in, and this yak will do you well until you find out if you're prepared to spend $$$ on a Hobie or similar.

The biggest downside to this kayak is, you will get wet, every time you use it.
Paddle splash and wave wash will make you wet, and inevitably cold every time you go out in not ideal conditions. one wave over the side and you are sitting in a puddle of water which always sucks a little joy out of the whole experience. This can be solved by taking out the scupper plugs under the seat, then of course you get a fresh splash every time you move around and the weight shifts. Just have to work out which one is less annoying for you i guess.

Enjoy mate!
Yak bests ~ 102cm Gummy ~ 57cm Pinky ~ 54cm Flathead ~ 49cm Whiting ~ 31cm squid. No pelagics, yet.
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Re: New Kayak (similar to glide pro from Rays @$999

Postby Yako » 27 Sep 2016, 00:25

FishnDive wrote:Believe it or not Rich in a paddle yak the turning circle is better with the rudder out of the water than in it. You shouldn't actually use a rudder to turn a paddle yak, its more to help track straight into the wind. If you are turning a paddle yak, you 'should' use a sweep stroke, with the rudder down the rudder is the pivot point, hence giving a long turning circle, if you pull the rudder up on the other hand the pivot point becomes the centre of the yak so it turns in its own length and is much more efficient.


Not really for turning but more for tracking Eoin was my thoughts with rudder on paddle yaks (although a larger rudder does work)
Having the oar in the centre , sure it changes you pivot point with your arms/oar taking more force. With a decent rudder you can achieve a good sharp turning circle it just responds differently to paddle. The rudder would be dependent on some forward motion whereas the oar/paddle isn't.

I find with my PA 14 the larger rudder (and if needs be my paddle to assist) with rolling waves works to steer. but then again the PA isn't really designed for rougher "surf" type conditions.
My PA swings around a lot quicker with my large custom rudder almost turning within it's own radius. I have to be reliant on it due to it's body width.
I think lighter narrower yaks control and steering is very different to the heavier Polyethylene yaks.

I'd be interested to hear from someone who has a longer paddle yak with a larger rudder how they go?
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Re: New Kayak (similar to glide pro from Rays @$999

Postby Smish » 27 Sep 2016, 08:03

Yako wrote:
FishnDive wrote:Believe it or not Rich in a paddle yak the turning circle is better with the rudder out of the water than in it. You shouldn't actually use a rudder to turn a paddle yak, its more to help track straight into the wind. If you are turning a paddle yak, you 'should' use a sweep stroke, with the rudder down the rudder is the pivot point, hence giving a long turning circle, if you pull the rudder up on the other hand the pivot point becomes the centre of the yak so it turns in its own length and is much more efficient.


Not really for turning but more for tracking Eoin was my thoughts with rudder on paddle yaks (although a larger rudder does work)
Having the oar in the centre , sure it changes you pivot point with your arms/oar taking more force. With a decent rudder you can achieve a good sharp turning circle it just responds differently to paddle. The rudder would be dependent on some forward motion whereas the oar/paddle isn't.

I find with my PA 14 the larger rudder (and if needs be my paddle to assist) with rolling waves works to steer. but then again the PA isn't really designed for rougher "surf" type conditions.
My PA swings around a lot quicker with my large custom rudder almost turning within it's own radius. I have to be reliant on it due to it's body width.
I think lighter narrower yaks control and steering is very different to the heavier Polyethylene yaks.

I'd be interested to hear from someone who has a longer paddle yak with a larger rudder how they go?


If you can steer with your feet the rudder shouldn't get in the way of turning while you're paddling, pinning the rudder full lock while you do a sweep stroke shouldn't offer much lateral resistance. The rudder just like a fin on a surfboard should ameliorate the rear of the kayak sliding sideways down the face of a wave giving you more control while you brace with a paddle. Even when I was paddling the blimp (inflatable) a big rudder at the back was essential with following seas to track straight and ride the waves in. The Viking Reload is interesting because the rudder sits in line with the keel i.e. it doesn't go deeper than the base of the hull so it has a marginal effect on the centre of lateral resistance.
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Re: New Kayak (similar to glide pro from Rays @$999

Postby laneends » 27 Sep 2016, 10:35

Yako wrote:
FishnDive wrote: The rudder would be dependent on some forward motion whereas the oar/paddle isn't.


This is the crux of it. I have the larger rudders fitted to both the quest 13 and the revo 16 and at full speed if I hit full lock on the rudder, they will turn sharp enough to feel like you could tip you out. On the other hand if you are just drifting along they have virtually nil effect and will actually work against trying to spin around with the paddle. Both yaks are fairly flat bottomed with minimal keel, so they spin easier than most without the rudder, even when you don't want them to.

To me the larger rudders have been safety items that have got me back in conditions that would have been a struggle otherwise.

The longer the water line the harder it is to turn by paddle alone. Advanced paddling skills will help.
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