Kayak Suitable Clothing, Pro's & Con's.

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cotso
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Re: Kayak Suitable Clothing, Pro's & Con's.

Post by cotso »

[quote="ELM

Cotton and Wool Clothes
Cotton and wool clothes should be avoided, in fact they have no place on a kayak as they absorb water, dry slowly and become heavy. Wearing wet clothing that breathes similar to cotton and wool will accelerate heat loss through wind chill and the extra weight will make it harder to extract yourself from the water

. A free moving fiber thermal layer like a polyester T-shirt and/or jacket (not cotton or wool)

Gday Elm. Good write up, but may i point out something, wool is one of the best fibers on the planet for keeping warm EVEN when wet, it can also keep you cool, That's why the Arabs wear those big white gowns, and why it's recommended as a base layer.I agree cotton is a NO NO and wool does get heavy when wet.Having worn a swan-dri all wool coat (famous New Zealand outdoor clothing manufacturer)for years hunting deer over winter , i can vouch for it's warm when wet call. But still Elm, good write up, and I did note your comment about not being an expert,me neither. Cheers mate
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Deefa
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Re: Kayak Suitable Clothing, Pro's & Con's.

Post by Deefa »

I went out today (which wasn't that cold) in this gear and in this order:
1mm lined neoprene vest
long sleeve synthetic bike top
3mm/2mm long john wet suit
PFD
3mm dive boots
And a hat.

Pretty much look like I do in my avatar pic.

I find I keep very warm up top, and that even though I only have the single layer on my arms the fairly thick weave of the bike top insulates quite well (I feel water splash as cold but it warms quickly). I can also swim easily in this setup (I swim 500m+ a few time a week in a pool, which helps)
One thing I have found the last couple of trips is the top of my feet up to my knees gets pretty cold over time (these are the wettest after launching). No peddling means no heat produced waist down.
Any suggestions for a thermal layer, long sock style? More neoprene? I haven't the budget for decent dry pants yet, so looking for functional if not beautiful, cheap solution.
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Haynsie
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Re: Kayak Suitable Clothing, Pro's & Con's.

Post by Haynsie »

Deefa wrote: One thing I have found the last couple of trips is the top of my feet up to my knees gets pretty cold over time (these are the wettest after launching). No peddling means no heat produced waist down.
Any suggestions for a thermal layer, long sock style? More neoprene? I haven't the budget for decent dry pants yet, so looking for functional if not beautiful, cheap solution.
A few guys on here (me included) wear Sealskin knee high waterproof socks. Find them on Ebay. They're awesome.

Cheers

Tim
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Deefa
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Re: Kayak Suitable Clothing, Pro's & Con's.

Post by Deefa »

The only sealskinz I can find - $52. Ouch! A quick check on aliexpress is no cheaper. :|

On the other hard, neoprene 3mm socks, $9.50. Hmmm... :?: :?: :?:
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Re: Kayak Suitable Clothing, Pro's & Con's.

Post by viperdevil »

Check melbourne dive head quarters(Next to Melb aquarium) they have sale time to time, try calling them and check if they have any sale..... i picked up my full seal skin suit last season at 50% off....... i have used it for early morning launches with 1 degree days with kokatats and hobie spray jacket on top and i was warm and toasty :up:
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Re: Kayak Suitable Clothing, Pro's & Con's.

Post by Babylon »

Deefa wrote:The only sealskinz I can find - $52. Ouch! A quick check on aliexpress is no cheaper. :|

On the other hard, neoprene 3mm socks, $9.50. Hmmm... :?: :?: :?:
The socks arnt cheap but they are brilliant and dry toes toes at the start of a winters trip make all the difference.Cheers babylon :thumbsup:
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Haynsie
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Re: Kayak Suitable Clothing, Pro's & Con's.

Post by Haynsie »

Worth every cent when it's wet and cold.
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Re: Kayak Suitable Clothing, Pro's & Con's.

Post by pato »

X 3 on the socks, dry toes are the go, bought mine online from chain reaction cycles in the UK on special, link below, arrived within a week.
http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Bran ... randID=118
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Deefa
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Re: Kayak Suitable Clothing, Pro's & Con's.

Post by Deefa »

I had better put an order in for christmas. :( The fish finder was my birthday present.

Thanks for the advice and where to get them, sounds like I will need to get it sorted soon.
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Re: Kayak Suitable Clothing, Pro's & Con's.

Post by Wedge »

ELM wrote:I don't wish to offend anyone nor am I dictating what anyone should wear,this is merely my opinion.
It scares me when we pat each other on the back, for skimping on the one thing that is going to save our lives if we are left stranded in cold water, "What We Wear".

The best way (IMHO) to find out if your gear is up to the challenge, is to test it in real life conditions. e.g. In the same areas and water/weather conditions you normally go kayaking in. Testing your gear in the next door neighbours solar heated pool in summer isn't going to show if your gear is capable of saving your life on PPB in the middle of winter.

Note: Do not let yourself get into a Hypothermic state. At all times make sure you have assistance, have a rescue plan & stay close to your dry clothes etc.

Go some where safe (next to car park) & with plenty of assistance, take some blankets (in case), dry change of clothes, something warm to drink (not alcohol) & have a rescue plan ready that everyone concerned understands (in case).
Have everything on the bank ready. Load your kayak as for a normal day (leash everything), put on your pfd, and then do a deliberate capsize in chest deep water and see how you go. Make sure you can right and board your kayak without touching the bottom. Once you're on board, see how long it takes for the cold to take effect on your muscles, etc, it's not over just because you are out of the water, wind chill through wet clothes has the potential to lower the skins surface temperature 4 degrees lower than that of the atmospheric temperature around you. Allow for the return trip.

I am no expert and I may be wrong, but here is my take on suitable kayak clothing (Warning, long winded).

Kayak Suitable Clothing, Pro's & Con's.
IMHO appropriate Kayak clothing is clothing that is worn to protect you from the elements. Appropriate kayak clothing should protect you from the sun, wind, rain and more importantly immersion.
The dangers from an immersion situation include;
(1)Hypothermia
(2)Cold Shock
(3)Drowning

My opinion is that you should dress for immersion first and foremost, then work on a balance in comfort, freedom of movement and surface protection after that. If you are not dressing for immersion, in my opinion, you are sadly (putting it politely) very mistaken and should not be on the water in or on a kayak. Remember, water conducts heat away from the body 25 times faster than air.
If you are getting cold on your kayak, then you are ill dressed for an immersion whether short or prolonged. If you are staying very warm or even getting hot then you are probably better suited to a prolonged immersion and will have a higher chance of survival when or if the situation arises. If you are getting cold on your kayak and cannot warm up, you are doomed and so is an enjoyable day out on your kayak, if you are overheating then simply take a dip, practice a quick re-entry to cool off, have a drink of water and continue your day on your kayak.

To properly protect yourself in an immersion, you need to minimize heat loss to the water around you. The only way to do that is to have a completely sealed barrier or have a close fitting thermal barrier and minimize water flow next to the skin. Conditions change on a regular basis so it is important to take notice of the condition and dress appropriately to best protect yourself and that is more easily achieved by layering
A good balance should include;
(1) Base layer (thermal).
(2) Secondary (waterproof / wind proof / UV protection)
(3) Accessories (hats / glasses / boots / further UV protection)
(4) Approved PFD Type 1 or Type 2.

Cotton and Wool Clothes
Cotton and wool clothes should be avoided, in fact they have no place on a kayak as they absorb water, dry slowly and become heavy. Wearing wet clothing that breathes similar to cotton and wool will accelerate heat loss through wind chill and the extra weight will make it harder to extract yourself from the water back onto/into your kayak where you can concentrate on managing heat loss. If you find yourself in an immersion situation, the most important thing is to get back out of the water as quickly and safely as possible.

PFD's
In Victoria, people using Kayaks & canoe's are required to wear either a Type 1 or Type 2 PFD.
PFD Type 1
A PFD Type 1 is a recognised life-jacket.
A PFD Type 1 will provide a high level of buoyancy and keep the wearer in a safe floating position. They are made in high visibility colors with retro-reflective patches and can be either an inflatable PFD or a flotation foam filled PFD.

PFD Type 2
A PFD Type 2 is a buoyancy vest – not a recognised life-jacket. It will provide less buoyancy than a PFD Type 1 but is sufficient to assist keeping your head above water for a short period of time. Like a PFD Type 1 they are manufactured in high visibility colors and only come as a flotation foam filled PFD.
Without a doubt, Type 1 PFD's are the safest to wear if you find yourself stranded in the water, however, flotation foam filled Type 1 PFD's can be quite bulky to wear and can be uncomfortable even difficult to wear on a kayak when paddling. Where as the inflatable style Type 1 PFD has minimal bulk allowing much more freedom of movement and comfort while sitting and paddling, but once inflated they become extremely bulky across the chest and behind the neck. If you are in the water and inflate your PFD, exiting the water to the safety of your kayak can be considerably hindered as is the ability to paddle because of the bulky inflation. If the PFD is deflated, it cannot be re-inflated until a new gas canister has been fitted, it is also no longer recognised as a life-jacket until a new canister has been fitted.
Another thing to consider with an inflatable PFD; if you were to be knocked unconscious before inflating your PFD and there is no one to assist you, your PFD will not inflate unless it is an auto inflate.

Type 2 PFD's on the other hand, while not being recognised as a life-jacket and being less buoyant than a PFD Type 1, are not as bulky to wear when seated and paddling a kayak or canoe. They will offer immediate support if you end up in the water and will offer less restriction while trying to remount your kayak. Flotation foam filled PFD's also offer some thermal protection to the upper torso of the body and can increase wind chill protection.

Ok so lets look at some different clothes that you will see or hear of others wearing;
Dry-suits
From personal experience a dry-suit is by far the best option as a secondary layer, but only if you keep it sealed and layer accordingly underneath to match that of the external climate and water temperature in your area. A dry-suit has little thermal quality so the layers you wear under it are important to balance according to conditions, always remember it is easy to cool down by hopping in the water where warming up can be a lot more difficult. A dry-suit however is of little use and becomes a hazard if it is not kept in good condition, if zips are not done up tight or seals leak. If you are wearing a dry-suit full of water, firstly you will struggle to get back on your kayak due to the extra weight from water in your suit, secondly water will not be able to drain away from your skin sapping important body heat and increasing the chances of hypothermia. Both ladies and men can also enjoy the comfort of relief zippers using catheter condoms or a She-p body fixtures or relief zips and in my opinion and from personal experience, "A MUST HAVE".

Long John Wet-suit;
If you cannot afford a dry-suit or prefer using neoprene then a good set of neoprene long John's will give your torso and legs thermal and UV protection, the thickness will depend on personal body heat loss and the amount of exercise one will be exerting, however for winter I think 3 mm should be a minimum in a cool climate like Melbourne. A free moving fiber thermal layer like a polyester T-shirt and/or jacket (not cotton or wool) may also be needed for the arms and upper torso, once again depending on the amount of excursion and personal body heat loss.
As a secondary layer, you could then go for a windproof spray jacket similar to what cyclists and sailors wear, they will once again allow freedom of movement through the shoulders while blocking UV, water spray (not immersion) and wind.

Windproof/Sprayproof Pants & Jackets;
Pants & Jackets that are loose fitting may be warm and protect you from splash, wind etc when on a kayak but will not give you any thermal protection in the water in an immersion, as the water can freely flow by your skin sapping important heat away, and should only be classed as a secondary layer.

Wet-suits;
Neoprene, as found in wet-suits, will offer thermal and UV protection and can be classed as your thermal layer, you need to note however. A tight fitting full wet-suit (like a diver would wear) will actually help cause fatigue from limiting freedom of movement, also full suits cause chaff and minimize freedom of movement through the shoulders and arms when paddling, causing further fatigue. Its also a good thing to remember, if you are wearing a neoprene suit and are wet, wind will penetrate the neoprene magnifying the chances of wind chill after an immersion, hence the need for a secondary layer to block the penetrating wind and reduce the effect of wind chill.

Waders;
A lot of people like to wear waders, specially neoprene waders, they are comfortable and can keep your feet warm and dry, there is no doubt about that. But waders have the potential to be as hazardous as an unzipped dry-suit, any layer that is not sealed, needs to be able to freely drain water away, having a sealed boot/leg like waders, will not drain and will hold water against the body sapping important heat away. They ability for water to enter your waders in an immersion, even with a belt, is very high, making the task of exiting the water, even harder due to the extra weight of the now trapped water. If by some chance you are “not” wearing a PFD and you enter the water head first, the air trapped in your waders has the potential to hold you upside down (head first) under the water. If you do wear waders, learn to do a somersault while in the water, this will then transfer the air from your feet back up to the waist of your wader where it is expelled and water gushes inside instead. In the end, remember the idea of your clothing is for protection and I would not recommend the use of waders on a kayak.

Shorts;
Shorts may be very comfortable to wear, light, offer freedom of movement and hold very little water but honestly I believe they have no place on a kayak when worn on there own.
As most if not all of your time on your kayak will be spent sitting down, your legs stretched out and exposed directly to the elements. Even if it is overcast your legs are exposed to excessive amounts of UV light, possibly causing sunburn or even under extreme circumstances, skin legions and melanoma's. In the colder months with your skin exposed to wind chill and splashes of cold water, your body will begin to shut down the extremities to try and protect the bodies core temperature and muscular strength and flexibility will decrease in the process. Not only will you become cold and uncomfortable after a period of time, your chances of sustaining cold-shock or hypothermia will be drastically increased in an immersion situation. If you are unable to use your muscles to right your overturned kayak and to get back aboard your kayak you are doomed.

Thick fleece Jackets;
While they are warm and comfortable, thick fleece jackets have the potential to become extremely heavy in an immersion situation, even synthetic jacket will hold a lot of water, which has the potential to make it hard to exit the water. The one thing that a synthetic jacket, will do, is drain/ dry a little quicker once out of the water, but in my opinion should not be worn on a kayak.

Socks/Boots
Heat loss through your feet is a major effect on a kayak. Your feet are constantly in contact with the water from the moment you start off, so protect them the same as the rest of your body with layers. A good pair of neoprene boots and thick thermal socks will help keep your feet warm. If you want to go one step further and keep them dry as well, do not go for waders. Sealskinz socks are waterproof, wear them as a secondary layer like a dry-suit, then layer with thermal socks underneath, that way your main suit will still drain via the open legs if you are immersed. Also note boots with zips will allow more water to flow through allowing a greater heat loss, if you can, get neoprene boots with no zip. Wet neoprene can help increase wind chill, so in extremely cool windy conditions, an outer wind blocking boot gaiter or bag may be necessary to keep your feet warm.

Accessories
It is common knowledge that most heat loss is through your head, as is a lot of hydration. A good hat is a must and while a wool beanie is comfortable, it is useless once wet. Go for synthetic hats Legionaries are great or neoprene hoods to protect the head.
Both direct and reflective radiation from the sun can also do a lot of damage, sun creams of SPF30+ and sun glasses are also a good idea to wear for increased protection and yes even in winter there is a danger from UV light and while we are on the subject of glasses, get polarized which will also help reduce surface glare allowing you to see into the water while you are at it.
Gloves are also very handy to have, they can protect your hands from fish spikes and squid bites, protect from cold and UV light or just wear them as a final fashion statement, which ever ones you go for, it's a good idea to check if they will help or hinder gripping a wet slippery overturned hull, removing the finger tips can also help manage tying knots etc without removing the whole glove and they can also help better grip your paddle.

As said at the start, this is only my opinion and I am not an expert in any way or form, and there is no substitute for testing what you wear in a real life situation with the necessary precautions taken to stay safe while testing.

Great post Elm. As a new comer to the Forum I really appreciate your comments and the other Yakers.

Wedge :clap: :clap:
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